MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

rds
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 9:32 pm

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by rds »

Mike , does your boat have running back stays ? factory installed ? just curios, my F44 has. it also seems that 22 kts wind speed should not be that high to overload the mast to the break point ? not sure if it true, I read somewhere that "Frog kiss"'s main mast been broken twice: one time in moderate winds , about 20-22 kts with no obvious warnings , notorious lightning strikes weakening the mast ? (the other time bumped out of the mast base in heavy seas, I do not know in what order they happened though ).. honestly I've hoisted my spinnaker once in light air but felt like that been a constant headache to look for the foremast boom's jibe. Anyway your mast accident made me thinking about longevity of our masts.. and if it somehow related to circular cracks maybe ? was your mast originally manufactured by TPI ? can you please elaborate where exactly mast broke ? if you had radome installed somewhere in that area on the mast , aftermarket installed sail track with extra holes ?
Last edited by rds on Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Mike Holibar
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:41 am

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by Mike Holibar »

No running backstays, probably because the main boom extends so far aft. The mast is tp about 1987. It is white and has no circular cracking problem. The mast broke about 3 metere above the deck and 2 metres below the radome. The mast has original aluminium track with new plastic track that is fitted into the old track with no new holes required. There were no new holes or any structural alteration to the mast in the area of the breakage. No lightning strikes either and the base is solidly in place. When we cut out the damaged section, we may be able to form a view as to any structural problems that may have contributed. I do have the feeling that we may have been in a short squall with wind shift and a much stronger blast of wind, but there wasnt time to look at wind instruments and of course they went over the side with the mast.
Mike Holibar
S/V Fyne Spirit of Plymouth (Freedom 39PHS-1989)
Lyttelton
New Zealand

rds
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 9:32 pm

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by rds »

thank you Mike , very interesting. my F44 has these back stays with running blocks and they should be hooked to rear cleats while under spinnaker .. and as far as I understand F39 and F44 have almost the same masts , the same diameter and length .. and F44 boom extends pretty far as well .. F44 manual says that windward back stay should be hooked, during my spin. trial I also lowered mizzen sail but hooked both stays to cleats
I understand, it is easy to say now .. in retrospective, maybe it was also necessary to keep main sail up all the time while running spinnaker to take some load off the mast ? I recall one of my friends had racing beach cat and broke his CF mast while running downwind under spinnaker simply because he released main sheet. so he told me that was his mistake and it was imperative to keep tension on main sheet to support the mast downwind with spinnaker .

Mike Holibar
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:41 am

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by Mike Holibar »

As we use the main boom to pole out the spinnaker, leaving the main up wouldn't give quite the support needed. The main sheet is fully extended with the sail at about 90 deg to the direction of force. Running backstays would seem to be the answer, and will certainly be employed in the future.
Mike Holibar
S/V Fyne Spirit of Plymouth (Freedom 39PHS-1989)
Lyttelton
New Zealand

User avatar
Castaway
Posts: 286
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 8:40 pm
Location: Lerwick, Shetland Isles

Re: Mast head Spinnaker loads

Post by Castaway »

A tale from the PO of Castaway; he was running under main and spinnaker in one of the acceleration zones around the Canaries, when the running backstay (also from the masthead) broke. He said the aluminium mizzen mast bowed alarmingly, and he thought it would break, but it held for long enough to weather the squall and then get the spinnaker down. The mast is standing, still.

We always use the runner with any of the staysails. It is attached at the same point as the topping lift, and is tacked down to the opposite quarter in use, or the toe-rail amidships if not. Doing this lets us use the mizzen boom to 'pole out' the spinnaker. We generally would have the mizzen set if we were using any other staysail. Of course, a sudden need to tack/gybe would be disastrous as both booms would be obstructed, so this is a clear waters only set-up.
Gerald Freshwater,
s/y 'Castaway', (UK F35 cat ketch, centreboard, 1987)
Lerwick Boating Club
Shetland Isles, Scotland

daletournier
Posts: 181
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2010 6:25 pm

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by daletournier »

Hi Mike, sorry to here about your mishap. Sorry if I didn't read your post correctly but were you running the spinnaker from the mast head? Like Geoffs 40/40 the F32 runs the spinnaker from about 7/8th mast position.
Cheers Dale
Freeform

Mike Holibar
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:41 am

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by Mike Holibar »

Hi Dale,
yes from the masthead. There is no provision to run it from a lower point, just an external halyard from a block at the masthead. I doubt if running it 7/8 would have made much difference, though it would probably require a smaller sail to do that, and the two things together may have helped.
Mike Holibar
S/V Fyne Spirit of Plymouth (Freedom 39PHS-1989)
Lyttelton
New Zealand

daletournier
Posts: 181
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2010 6:25 pm

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by daletournier »

Hi Mike, where in Malaysia are you doing the repairs? Im currently in Bali and plan on heading back up towards Phuket this year, most likely not until after March.
cheers Dale.

Mike Holibar
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 12:41 am

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by Mike Holibar »

Hi Dale,
Sorry to be so long replying. We are in Pangkor Marina, Lumut, near Pangkor Island. Fyne Spirit is in the covered hard stand. My Malaysian number is 0137407073. It would be great to meet you.

We have been making good progress with repairs until the west system resin ran out:(. We have cut about 850mm of damaged section out and are making a tube insert to line everything up. The outside ends have been scarfed back about 700mm each. We should be joining the two bits soon. I have been taking pictures along the way and hope to post some soon.
Mike Holibar
S/V Fyne Spirit of Plymouth (Freedom 39PHS-1989)
Lyttelton
New Zealand

Riki
Posts: 46
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:50 pm

Re: MAST REPAIR PROCESS F39PHS?

Post by Riki »

This is my first post on this site. My husband and I have been looking for a sailboat for a while and think we've found the one. We just did a survey on a '97 40/40 this past Saturday. I don't think there are major issues. Some minor ones need to be resolved, but I keep reading through this site and other sites to learn as much as possible, . I looked on wikipedia and was surprised that it says that it's known that the unstayed mast "in rough seas it can break loose, causing a potential holing". So I started looking for "mast failures" and found this thread. I had heard that there had been mast failures, although very rare, so I was surprised to see several mentioned in this brief thread.

Any other members break their masts? What other lesson can we learn in order to avoid the mast breaking?

Has anyone experienced a "holing" or heard of a holing?

Thanks!
1997 Freedom 40/40 Hull #27

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